Micro Bubbles/ skimmer?????

[essexboy73]

Ok first of all im new to this whole thing! Ive been doin alot of research and i just started my tank abouit two days ago:
46 gall, 50 lbs of LR, 50Lbs of crushed coral, canister filter with 4 bio medias, 2 maxi jets 1200, 2 Oscul. Clowns, and a 65gall cpralife needle wheel skimmer.

My question is about the skimmer. I just installed it two days ago and i understan all of the break in process, but still have some questions. First, i really dont understand what is meant by it has to "break in". Ive read alot of posts on this and all everyone says is it must break in, what the heck does that mean??? I know that its not goin to produce too much slime untill my tank has matured and really starts to produce alot of organics and proteins. My problem with it is all the micro bubbles in my display. Will they ever go away? Is this part of the "break in" and if so why does this happen??
My skimmer is also filling up in the cylinder about 2 inches from the top. Ive adjusted the water flow to completly open, still fills all the way up.
Please help aleviate my worries!!! Hate these d** bubbles!!!

Oh yea been adding some Ca as well, the two step stuff with the buffer...didnt know if this could cause alittle more bubbles then norm??

[Sugar Magnolia]

The micro bubbles really are a pain, but they will go away after the skimmer "breaks in". (sorry, couldn't resist. :D) Basically what happens over the next week or so, a slime coat will form on the inside of the skimmer. Apparently the bubbles pop before they exit the skimmer.

On a side not, be sure you have a calcium and alkilinity test kit if you're dosing the supplement. It's easy to accidentally overdose and end up with ca and alk out of whack.

[Aquatic Realms]

Ok first off let me say in advance my post isn't to be mean I am just trying to save you from a LOT of problems in your future!

Ok...here goes the tourture. :wink: :-D

1) You stated your tank is only 2 days old. You should NOT have 2 Ocellaris Clown's in your tank yet! I wouldn't put ANY fish in there for at LEAST close to 2 weeks. You tank is not cycled yet.

2) You have 50 Lbs of CC (Crushed Coral). That is not what you want to have as a substrate. Orginisims can't get in there and move that stuff around like sand. It will become a massive detritus trap and cause you to have elivated Nitrates and Phosphates.

3) Scrap the Canister Filter! They are MAJOR detritus traps! You don't even need to run one. The canister filter will cause your Nitrates and Phosphates to rise in time.

4) You have 2 MaxiJet 1,200's Get some more water flow. Add a couple more.

5) Replace your skimmer with a AquaC Remora (Packpack) skimmer. It is more expencive, but well worth the money. Also, make sure to get one rated for MORE gallons than your tank. If you run the skimmer well enough you won't even need any other filtration. With proper water changes.

6) I would also recommend a Hang-on Refugium as it will help to eliminate your Nitrate and Phosphate levels. Reason is because any macro algae contained in it will feed off of those levels as its food.

7) SLOW DOWN. :wink: Patients is what makes great reefs! Remember Mother Nature took millions of years to make the reefs we have in the oceans. There is NO rush to make one in your tank overnight. Plus rushing in this hobby will only lead to failure.

Well...now that I beat you down with a wooden stick...I will enlighten on the skimmer problem. :wink: :razz: :lol:

Your skimmer will produce those bubbles until a layer of proteins collects inside the skimmer allowing the bubbles to pop within the skimmer. This is how the skimmer works. It uses the bubbles to agitate the water within it and it will in time create a foam of proteins which are the nutrients within your water that would normally turn into Nitrates and Phosphates.

It will go away once it breaks in. Had to say it too. :-D

Hope I wasn't too rough on ya?

Your medical insurance should cover the hospital bills of me beating ya with that stick of mine. :razz: :-D :lol:

Best of luck!

Remember....go slow and ASK questions if ever in doubt!

[marshalrckman]

Ouch take it easy there AR,I dont agree on the clowns in there at all!And i like crushed coral i dont have problems with my nitrates and phosphates,i usually vacum it once a week.And the canister filter i would be careful with,its kind of like an M-16,ppl say it sucks b/c it gits dirty but the key is keeping clean and maintained.
BTW if by chance one of your clowns dies in there,leave it so that way it will help your cycle.

[FishinInTheDark]

You should not leave the dead clownfish in your tank, IF it dies. That will only add to the stress (and probably demise) of the remaining fish. Since you have live fish in the tank, you will have to monitor your ammonia levels and keep them from becoming toxic. This may slow down your cycle a bit, but it will help save your brand new fishies!

[essexboy73]

Man you cant beat me down with that criticism...its the only way to learn, like i said im new....Thanks for finally explaining the "break in " theory. I was trying to figure it out logically and nothing was comming to me.
Plan on getting a Ca test device as well...i was reading about it on here the other night!
The substrate that i have is actually 40Lbs of fine sand and 10Lbs of the med grade crushed coral that i sprikled on the top to give it some asthetic. Do you think that this is ok or should i mix them together pretty good??
As for the canister filter...the d** thing is giving me problems already. Came home from work this Am and it was half full and the intake from the tank was not flowing...the return to the tank was makin more micro bubbles then the skimmer(wounderfuL!!!) So got it reprimed this afternoon. But anyway you said that i dont even need a filtration device??? I plan on using this just for a few months to hold me over until i get a sump running underneath. But if i ddint use any filtration system where would i put my activated carbon and things like that. Ive also heard that thtey are good for harboring good algea??

With only having a 46 gallon i thought that the water flow would be enough considering the two power heads, my filter and my skimmer all running, didnt want my fish to drown from too mush current???

And as for the clowns ive gotten mixed reviews on that..i personaly didnt want to get them until my tank was done cycling, but my Gf talked me into it....beleive me she paid for the fish..LOL The amonia hasent spiked at all yet, i know its only been about 4 days but i think that the live rock i got was pretty good stuff!! Time will only tell!

One cool thing i didnt find today was a crab about 3 1/2 inches big in a hole in my rock. Pretty cool little guy with black tipped claws, white shell... only hope that he can get out of the hole!!!

Thanks for your inputs!!!!!!!

[FishinInTheDark]

Oh, Essex. I hate to do this to you. . .

I remember when I started my first reef tank. I set up the hardware, added live rock and water, and then waited to see what hitchhikers I could find. I was so thrilled to see so many cute little brown anemones popping out of the rock the very first night. Lo and behold, these were pest aiptasia, and I was disappointed to have to eradicate them.

Well, to make a long story longer, your big, cool, black-tip clawed crab is a bad guy. He is probably a xanthid crab, and will certainly be destructive to corals, inverts, etc. I would counsel you to get rid of him right away. In fact, just today I found a black-tip clawed xanthid in my very own tank. I cooked him right in his rock hole with a turkey baster full of boiling water, and my +12" fireworm had a hearty meal of him.

At any rate, I empathize with your excitement and disappointment, but that crab's gotta go!

[essexboy73]

man you gys sure are making me sore for my first time!!! I thought he was cool! Well i guess that will help spike my amonia levels a little bit...is the turkey baster with boiling water a sure fix??

[Aquatic Realms]

I would pull the rock if you can out of your tank to do that.

You risk upsetting the temp ballance within your tank otherwise.

JMO

[FishinInTheDark]

Honestly, one turkey baster of hot water won't change your temperature. Unless you have a super baster, you're only talking 30 ml or so of water. Even two squirts won't affect much. If you know what hole he's in, just go for it.

[FishinInTheDark]

I just looked it up. One U.S. liquid gallon is 3785.41 ml. Thirty, sixty, or even ninety ml in 46 (theoretical) gallons of water (which converts to 174,128.94 ml) isn't going to upset much! :-D

[Aquatic Realms]

But you are talking about 78-80*F water vs 180*F+

There is a "slight" temp difference there though. ;)

[maxwellwhothunk]

but at 30ml per squirt that means that per ml you have approx 5804ml for the heat to transfer to. The amount at that point would be negligible. However, there is the flash of heat that can and will kill stuff, which in this case is a good thing... because thats what you want.

I am trying to figure out the equation for figuring out water temps., if anyone has it please share.

-Max

[maxwellwhothunk]

Ah I think i figured it out.

Ok so to calculate the tempurature Increase you need to know the amount of both liquids. So in this case we'll go with ml.

174,128 = the amount of ml in his tank (46gal)
lets say the average squirt of a turkey baster is 100ml

the tank temp is at a constant 80 deg. f
The once boiling water's temp when added to the aquarium is 190 deg f.

first you want to find a difference between the water temps.

So 180-80=100 deg f

100deg f divided by the tank's new volume after the squirt of 174,228. Which in this case is equal to .00057396 you add this tempurature to the inital temperature and you get the final temp.

80.00057 deg F... if all my math is correct, which I am almost positive it is, that figure is right.

This makes sence. Put it into an equation using simple numbers, for example.

if you have 1 gal @ 80 deg F and you add 1 gal @ 127 deg F what do you get.

Well, 127-80= 47 degrees difference between the two temps.

Divide 47 by the final amount of water in the system, in this case 2 gal, and you get 23.5.

Add this to the initial tank tempurature and you get 103.5 deg f.


Let me know if I did something wrong.

-Max

[maxwellwhothunk]

Ok now to figure it out algebraicly (sp?)

tank the initial tank volume and multiply it by the temp
46gal X 80deg F = 3680 gal degrees (I know if you havent taken physics stuff like that sounds weird... but it is right within this system, it might be called something differently somewhere else.) (gd is what I will refer to it from now on... I am NOT representing gangs ... lol)

and to keep the figures simple lets say we add a 1 gal squirt of hot water (ok you have a lot of bad crabs or something)

1gal X 180deg F = 180gd

Now if you know newtons laws you will know that the initial energy within a system is a constant, it will NEVER CHANGE.

if you add the gal degrees together you get total gd=3860

you know what g is, so just 'plug it in, plug it in" what can I say, my geometry teacher taught us catchy ways to learn geometry.

if you dont know g=2 because that is the amount of gal now in the system.

so d=3860/47=82.12766 (82.12765957... if you really care that much... thats as far as the calculator that I am using goes to)

hth,
Max

[Aquatic Realms]

You are probibly right with your math, but call me old fassion...I won't put any thing in my tanks that will cause any chance of problems. ;)

[maxwellwhothunk]

if you plug in those numbers that I used in the last post, into the first method that I used, you'll get roughly the same number. Make sure you use the same numbers, otherwise your numbers will be off.

I did it again, with quite a bit of precision, and I found that the resulting temp would be 80.06313532 deg F in a 46 gal tank with a 0.0264172051 US gallon squirt of water (which is 100ml in gallons)

Ok, this is the point where I run away in shame of my level of geekiness
-Max

(this was edited because I wrote the wrong thing)

[maxwellwhothunk]

Sorry, I was working on that last post when you responded. But I totally agree! But given his situation, he has something that is potentially more dangerous than the .063 increase in water temp.

Granted alternative methods might be the best starting point, and move up to something more 'risky' if the other methods prove to be not working.

But yeah, again... I agree 100%

-Max