Macro algae or mangroves?

[pomme]

Macro algae or mangroves?

I have been thinking of having a macro algae section in the sump to complement the skimmer.

But i was reading today in one of my books that mangroves can be just as good if not better then maro algae. I have heard many people saying that mangroves are no good at nutrient export. But i read that they need weeks to acclimatise to the aquariums conditions, 2-6 weeks, and then they dont have there full impact on water quality untill 3-6 months. So could it be people dont like them becuase they dont have an immdeiate impact on water quality. I can see a few advantages of mangroves over macro algae, in that it doesnt go sexual, ie caulerpa, and it doesnt need harvesting as much, ie caulerpa or chaetomorpha.

So what do you guys about both the macro algae and mangroves.

Andrew

The mangroves are great in my opinion. I have about 18 of them in my system but then again its a dedicated 140 gallon refugium. It does indeed take a while to get them adjusted to your tanks water. They do grow slow. But they do put out an extensive root system that might challange the ability of a small glass container to contain without breaking or leaking. I noticed a signifgant improvement in my water quality after about six months. As you mentioned...this may be one reason why others are reluctant to utilize them more than they do. Recently I did add Cheato to my refugium about 5 months ago. As such I havent been running a skimmer and the water quality is holding up very well. I kinda like a combination of both personally. The other mitigating factor to the equation is that I also have about 90 lbs of live rock and 45 lbs of live rock rubble in the refugium too. I also have a very light bio-load, only 5 small fish and 6 Clams and about 33-35 SPS corals in my display.

As far as the set up goes, I am really liking it in a major way. So much so that I have started to put together a 300 gallon refugium that will be hooked up to a 240 gallon plus tank in the not too distant future. I am establishing the refugium for this tank first as I believe that it would be more benifical to start my set up with a well established refugium before adding a tank to the mix. I am hoping to minimize problems with non benifical algaes that we try so hard to avoid during and after a new tank is set up. I am hoping too that this will facilitate a quicker cycling period as well. All this is just purely speculation at this point and just an experiment. I will try to get about 15-20 mangroves in this refugium. I have added some Razor Caulerpa, Dwarf Feather Caulerpa, Chaetomorpha macro algaes thus far. I am toying with the idea of also adding some Eel Grass as well a little later when I order the Mangroves.

I am not a purist but I do like the idea of a more "natural" filtration/nutreint export set up. I also like the concept of having as much bio-diversity in my tank as possible although I realize this is very small when compared to natrual reef enviroments. But I figure going this route can only make my system better, more stable, and be less costly in that I wont have to runn as much carbon, resins etc..

I think too that you would be better with a dedicated Refugium. I understand that this is not always possible due to cost or space or both. I think the refugium section in your sump will be much more effective if you can restrict the flow of water to a much slower rate that is typically used in a sump to allow enough contact time with the water for nutreint uptake to more thoroughly occur. I highly recommend a Refugium of anysize that you can fit into your system. I think you will like the results too!

JMHO......

[pomme]

Imaexpat2, cool thanx for the great reply. Yeah i am going to use a skimmer, a underated one but there just for assurances.

I am thinking of having the mangroves, i was thinking of around 10 (for a 300 gal system) to go in dedicated refugium which will be 20" by 20" , and the flow will be able to be controlled. This sump will have some live rock but no sand, or do you think it would be best with something like miracle mud? And then have around 40 cm above the water line for the mangroves to grow. And then have a t8 tube for a planted tropical tank, the ones for the plants. This will be in the cabinet below the tank as then the humidity will be higher for the mangroves :)

Does that sound all okay?

by the way your set-up sounds brilliant :), and i think the way your doing the tank change over sounds brilliant, as it would be like adding etxta water for a water change instead of taking some away. And i think doing it that way you shouldnt get anything like hair algae etc, but because it will be alot of water etc there may be some silicates for the salt used so may be some diatoms :(.

good luck with it.

andrew

pomme,

Sounds like a good game plan. I would recommend though that you get some substrate though about 2-3 inches. The mangrove roots dont really need a substrate and can grow without it as long as you anchor them with rock rubble. I just think it would be a bit easier from the start to have a little sand. I used Oolitic sand and some GARF Grunge and Grunge Lite in mine. I am sure mine is a little deeper than need be. I personally think miricle mud is over priced and over rated. Thats why I just used a bags of sand instead. I just seeded it with the Grunge and Grunge Light for bateria and critters that live in the sand. Your lighting will be fine. I am using twin 40 watt T-12 grow lights designed for plants. Its cheap and easy.

Yeah thats one of the biggest things I have noticed about my tanks with refugiums...I miss out on a lot of the algae problems that many have. Just an occasional powdering on the glass every now and again. Thats it. The refugium looks almost as nice as the tank. Wished I had a digital camera as my refugium is really set up nice and words cant begin to discribe it.

Good luck and keep us up to date...

[pomme]

cool thanx again, okay ill go for a a small amount of substrate.

i wish you had a digi cam to :)

andrew

[c1ownfish]

Just thought I would throw in a couple things!! I have a 75gal display with a 20gal fuge. In my fuge I have 4 mangroves which have been in there for about 4 months and my water quality has greatly improved since I put them in there! I also have some macro! I think you need some sort of substrate to help hold the mangroves and they will put out a web of roots after awhile!! If you put them in a closed canopy (which mine are in at the moment but I want to change!) be sure to nip the growth bud so they don't get to tall also that will make them bushier!!

HTH!

[c1ownfish]

Double Post!

[pomme]

lovely tank youve got there.

when you say your water quality has greatly improved, have you got any sort of figures?

and did you have the macro before you added the mangroves?

[c1ownfish]

Here are a couple of my test results! I think the greatest improvement has been with the Nitrates.

On 2/9
Sal: 1.025
Temp: 74
pH: 8.2-8.4
Ammonia: .25
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: 20
Alkalinity: 1.1
Phospate: 0
Silica: 1

On 6/15
Temp: 76
Salinity: 1.024
pH: 8.0
Alkalinity: 0-.7
Amm: .25
Nitrite: 0-.05
Nitrate: 0-5
Pho: 0-.1

[pomme]

yeah it has made a big improvement to your nitrate. You have got me convinced now thanx.

Andrew

pomme

My results were roughly the same FWIW.

[Blitzkrieg]

I noticed c1ownfish's Alkalinity is down a bit low. Refugiums have not taken off in Australia, however I did ask around and I was told that mangroves would soften the water. I've read that magnesium may also need to be added because the mangroves will use it up.

Does any of this add up? Or am I just paranoid?

[c1ownfish]

Well keep in mind that I have been using tap water!! I have ordered a typhoon from airwaterice.com and should be getting sometime next week and that will help with my water!! I also haven't added any supplements recently. I was out of town for work and was lucky to come home to fish! :roll: The Hubby is a car junky doesn't know much about tanks!

[pomme]

Cool i hope that the filter will help with the water quality :)

[Blitzkrieg]

OK thanx. Nice setup by the way. That tap water is pure evil :evil: .